serena
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Posts: 9
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Post by serena on Aug 26, 2005 18:46:12 GMT -5
I have to bid on a 40,000 Square Foot office building with 6 bathrooms. I need help on estimating how many people it would take and how long. I don't know how many people I would need and how long it would take...
Thanks
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Post by Kevin on Aug 27, 2005 3:26:33 GMT -5
Serena Welcome to the forum, Ill be glad to help, where are you from? And how long would it take you to clean 1000 sq. ft., also what type of space is it industrial, medical, office..etc.. more information required, what type of flooring? how many days a week?
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serena
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Posts: 9
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Post by serena on Aug 27, 2005 7:24:21 GMT -5
Denver Area,Single Floor Office Building, half of the flooring is carpet and hallways are the tile. Seven days a week. It will be mostly offices and cubicles so it shouldn't take to long per 1000 sq ft, maybe 30 minutes i don't know. I was hoping maybe someone else had an account with this much sq ft and could say "it takes us this many hrs with this many people".
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Post by CleaningChick on Aug 27, 2005 7:59:14 GMT -5
Serena, the "normal or average" cleaning production rate for office buildings is 3,500 sq. ft. per hour. However, if this bldg. is to be cleaned 7 days a week, I would bid it at 4-5,000 sq. ft. per hour depending on what kind of business it is and what kind of public traffic it gets. Larger buildings that are cleaned with a greater frequency tend to take much less time than you would think to clean, after the building is at a maintainable level.
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serena
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Post by serena on Aug 27, 2005 8:55:38 GMT -5
Thank you very much Cleaning Chick.
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Post by CleaningChick on Aug 27, 2005 9:04:49 GMT -5
No problem.
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serena
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Post by serena on Aug 28, 2005 9:04:27 GMT -5
Well I ran some numbers and I came in well above what the company paid the previous cleaners. I know they were paying just over 2K per month. I dont know how tthe cleaning company made any money as that would pay for 2 people only before any overhead or profit. 2 people working 7 days 4 hrs per $9/hr is $2160 alone which is close to what the company paid the previous cleaners. My numbers are around 3000. Does that sound to high to you all ? What would be the normal or average if you all were bidding?
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Post by Kevin on Aug 28, 2005 9:11:57 GMT -5
Ok let me see if i can help, what is the cleanable sq. ft? You stated the building is 40,000 is that your cleaning area? How do you know what they paid the former cleaners, did the business tell you or the cleaners/ Sometimes the business will state ya...blah..blah we paitd the cleaners this much, which is false.. but it is good information to have because you have the number they want. ? Your numbers that your working on how did you arrive at them? Give me an example of what your overhead is, at least what your including? Are you providing supplies or no supplies, sorry for all the details, but this sounds like a important job. The more details the better, :)Are you providing any thing special, carpet cleaning, strip and wax, or is that seperate?
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serena
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Post by serena on Aug 28, 2005 10:23:18 GMT -5
I know what they paid their previous cleaners because I have seen the invoices from the previous cleaners but I don't know how many people they used. The cleaning sq footage is 35000. They have stated already that I am going to get the contract and I have not even given them a bid yet. They will provide the bathroom supplies, I will provide the normal cleaning supplies. My rough numbers are the following: 3 people - $2150 based on cleaning 4500 sq ft per hr per person Overhead - 450 to 500 per month Insurance & Bonding,Cleaning Supplies, Equipment Costs,taxes,etc... Profit $250 As you can see, I am up around 3K/Month. They paid the previous cleaners about 2200 per month. My special cleaning is seperate just like the previous cleaners. As you can see the previous cleaners charge would only cover the labor on my bid.
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serena
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Post by serena on Aug 29, 2005 16:11:17 GMT -5
What do you think? Is my estimate out of whack for this building or what? I dont know how the previous cleaners did it for only 2200.
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J4K Cleaning
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[M:-60]
J4K Cleaning Company
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Post by J4K Cleaning on Aug 29, 2005 16:22:20 GMT -5
I think your bid seems low, profit of $250 per month? Is that even worth it? I would not worry about what they paid the other company, come up with figures that work for you and what you need to make to provide quality service, after all they are getting rid of the other comapany! Unless I am missing something, like 10,000 sq feet is open area with nothing in it, I would re do your figures.
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Post by Kevin on Aug 29, 2005 20:25:35 GMT -5
[glow=blue,2,300]****Great Advice from Jeff**** I would not worry about what they paid the other company, come up with figures that work for you and what you need to make to provide quality service[/glow] Are you adding your entire insurance cost into this account? Purity would charge for this service agreement. All cleaning supplies and labor included. First 8 hours labor to me is not enough, not for a quality job. We also include drive time into all of our estimates. I'm not sure how far you are away from the account. I would estimate it at 77 hrs a week or 11 hours a day. I would have two staff at $8.00 an hour, Labor $2464.00 month Supplies $250.00 month Management Fee=$500.00 Misc $75.00 All floor work would be included, strip and wax. All window washing outside would be included, as long as 1st story. Total $3289.00 This would be a fair price, for the Detroit area, in Denver I believe the economy is better, you should get more. If you reverse this and look at the consumers point of view. If they had 2 Janitors, working 77 hrs a week a full timer and part timer , lets sat at 8.00 an hour they would be at $2464.00 with supplies being a janitor, more than likely untrained, not really caring about how much he/she uses $325.00 Total $2789.00, also Note:as janitors have a 90 day turn over rate this should be a selling point in all proposals.. the cost of training, advertising, and hiring a janitor that is only gonna last maybe 90 days. Your service provides this to the customer. You are supplier of the cost of this service. Also you know so much as having the past invoices, have you asked why the other service is being dismissed. I would also call the other service for the full scoop. It seems that the customer wants the lowest bid possible, (like most customers) is their a possible financial condition that is in play, or do you consider them a strong viable company. ? With a customer that always wants the lowest bid, going through janitorial services is a common problem, i would also tell them that, as they are well aware. When talking to the former service provider, ask them about the situation when they received the building and the bid proposal. Some good questions to ask are how long were you there? Did the customer pay on time? What is your overall thought on working for x company. WARNING you are going to hear alot of negative, they just got fired. But be sincere in your efforts looking for information. I would also use this information in the final bid proposal sit down. I actually believe in a little boldness, I would tell the manager "I spoke with former cleaners and he stated this, what are your thoughts, on his opinion of cleaning for your company" I know some of you might be thinking.. geez you trying not to even get the account, thats to bold... the way we see it at Purity is if your hiring us, were not looking to be the last service you just threw out of here, were looking for the service that is here for good. Yes I will call the other service, and get an opinion and information, At one time also I got off at a bad start the beginning of the contract with the manager, who signed us on, (yelled at one of my staffers, while i was there) So guess what I subcontracted the last service she had in there, and put them back to work in the same account. You should have saw the look on her face. SHOCK She asked me what in the *$%$%$% do you think your doing, I told her my contract with you, is to provide labor and cleaning supplies that is what we are doing, since you yelled at my employee, he no longer wants to come back here and work for you, so we had to fulfill our end of the agreement, these are your new cleaners, under my guidance of course. Note: We still have the contract, the former service is still working there, Purity still collects a management fee,and she was fired about three months after our confrontation. I called her and said, Mary we cleaned out your office area after your termination. We found some loose change behind the desk, just to inform of our lost and found policy, We gave it to John the (new manager). In regards to hiring the old service as a direct subcontractor, sometimes the other service needs and deserves a 2nd chance with proper guidance, as long as you are the larger company this deal is easy to negotiate. They still received there original fee for cleaning, Plus an extra $150.00 a month, Since we also have a good relationship with our Janitorial supplier,also selling supplies, the supply cost went down, which I increased their contract. Since they are backed by Purity being a small Mom & Pop when they want a vacation, or a requested day off the account is covered.. Im sure alot of you may be like Wow!! This my friends is the new wave of janitorial service, larger companies hiring small companies and accepting a management fee. Large companies providing training, supplies and support for the mom and pops. Together we are stronger!
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serena
New Forum Member
Posts: 9
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Post by serena on Aug 30, 2005 7:35:20 GMT -5
well, the distance is only 10 minutes and I am not worried about them not paying, my husband is the controller there, he pays the bills and they are a strong company. That is how I know what they paid in the past. He is not the one making the decision though, the facilities manager is. He alredy told me he really likes entrepreneurs and he pretty much told me I have the job even though I haven't given him a bid yet which to me doesn't mean he is looking for the lowest bid. I just wanted to be able to give a fair bid and the previous cleaners I think were to low. Thanks for all the input.
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